When you have little kids or "interesting" partners who create chaos, it is very hard to get into Category 2 mode. Every day is a different day; you are always reacting to another's moods and needs. The freedom that precedes discipline is the freedom to *be* disciplined - a certain degree of control over your own daily life. Agency itself is a gift to be pursued and held. Great essay.
Yes, good point. The room to be consistent, such as running at the same time each day, may not be possible for everyone.
That said, the main idea is motivation is a mentally expensive process to rely on. If we can somehow push through the pain barrier and make something a habit we rely much less on motivating ourselves.
So it does presume the ability to carve out time for important things, which is not true for everyone.
“Discipline is difficult to discern, and it looks like motivation from the outside, but it is really automated behaviour.”
This is how you can drag yourself to the gym after too many glasses of Bordeaux the night before and leave feeling like you just had a spa day.
I often conflate lifting and writing in my routines. One discipline informs the other. Extremely helpful comparison.
Additional food for thought: spiritual training exercises also work off this principle of discipline vs motivation. The goal being to get into a state of mind which is “automatic” and not continually dislodged or thrown off-balance by the eternal Clowning going on all around us.
Thanks for this, Spiff. Very timely. Battling through some jet lag but today is bench/squat day.
I do think it is a universal path. We need some initial motivation of course. We get fat or weak and it motivates us to do something. I think those who fail continue to rely on motivation whereas the winners graduate to some form of mental automation.
There is something to be said for gritting your teeth and getting on with it.
I might have mentioned it before, but “Willpower” by Dr Roy Baumeister was really transformative and gives clear research supporting your claims. Discipline actually conserves willpower because you’re not making many agonizing choices. “Will I go to the gym or not? Will I do a half work out or a full work out? Will I finish this set?” You just pick the program and don’t let the question even come up. Now I only stop if I feel like I could injure some muscle. Another mental framing that is helpful is pre planned “If X, then Y” for what could happen. “If I get winded, then I’ll go on the elliptical rather than treadmill.” That type of stuff is good because it front loads the decision making process when your brain and body are not fatigued.
I don't do the gym (small and skinny so would get the figurative sand in my face, maybe LOL). But it occurred to me as I was reading your piece that I have often recommended to people that they should encourage their children to learn a "discipline" like learning a musical instrument - the only thing I can speak with any authority on, as it happens - without really being conscious of why I was using that particular word, instead of "hobby" or "pastime" for example.
Then it became clear. Even now after most of a life playing the guitar, the process of starting to learn a new piece with any amount of challenge is still a slow drag for the first few sessions, with the feeling of little or almost imperceptible progress, as if I have never been here before with every other piece I have eventually (more or less) mastered.
It's as you say exactly. The disciplinary path is by nature more an act of blind faith that the result will happen; we need to completely forget motivation, because it's just too capricious and inconsistent a driver to make the leap from one plateau to the next.
It's the same with climbing a hill. People say to me : "Don't you get a bit bored just going up and climbing the same range of hills every week?". Well, I've been doing exactly that for so many years now that I don't even think about whether I should just give it a miss because the conditions are not great.....or it might be better in a few days....etc. I just make it a rule that at least once a week, I will head up and do a few hills. And some days are better conditions than others, but it's almost incidental. It needs to be for all the reasons you describe.
I think motivation is the start. You are motivated to lose weight or begin hiking, for instance. But it cannot sustain the activities. Something else must do so.
Discipline I suspect is really an umbrella term for initially forcing yourself to repeat an activity long enough to make it a habit. From then on the brain's various reward loops assist with keeping it going.
Oh yes, the motivation must always be there in some form to initiate anything, I agree. But maybe for most, once the task or task path is initiated, it has served its purpose largely, as the results become the reward and the process perpetuates itself.
Yes. Discipline applies to many things; music (you have to practice every day), exercise, being tidy, brushing your teeth!
I wonder if discipline is inherent; some people just seem more disciplined than others at an earlier age. I feel I've had to learn discipline.
As someone who has lifted 4 days a week, week in and week out, for decades I can attest to discipline being more important than motivation. Motivation may get you excited but discipline sustains you when it sucks.
But on the other han some are disciplined about a lot of things…in fact, according some research what we call “genius” is not really intelligence as much as disciplined devotion to a particular endeavor.
I do agree it can be learned, though…I certainly had to learn it.
It is difficult to say. Perhaps some just have a capacity for repetition. Many nowadays have low boredom thresholds, so it is difficult to imagine they will be self-disciplined as it is often quite boring to establish habits.
My oh my, what a truth bomb. I hate gym. Never went for the social aspect either. But you are so right! The only discipline i display is in my work. Definitely cat 2 there! Best wishes for 2025!
This is a good piece, and I will have to reread it to digest it fully. However, I think you may have sparked an inspiration for me to write my own similar article about the "types" who attend therapy because they would be verrrrry similar.
I liken your spot on analogy to the sport of football, which I have on this time of year since it’s mainly cold here November to February. Teams seem to need pepped up motivation to perform, which fades when setbacks occur and constantly need to try to remotivate(some do some don’t). Personally, I prefer the disciplined, consistency of the steady and detail oriented coaches and styled teams. Funny(not really), the pepped ones draw all the attention but the disciplined succeed more, or at least used too, and are usually more humble when they do. Anyway, love your common sense words of wisdom as usual. God Bless you in a disciplined New Year ahead!!!
Motivation is great to get started. It is probably a necessity. But remaining stuck using motivation is not sustainable as it is mentally expensive. I think that is all it is.
Motivation is probably good for CHANGE, but inappropriate for CONSISTENCY. Perhaps that is it.
You can move from Cat1 to Cat2, I have observed. Can't exactly pin it down but I'd say it happens if the Cat1 makes discipline part of the motivation and makes it over the hump(s), to eventually realise that the initial motivation is gone, and has been replaced with discipline, habit and real change.
It is much the same as the process for alcoholics and drug users. Some have some form of motivation, and fail. Some have dredged up whatever iota of discipline they have left, and succeed. The ratio (doesn't matter if it's smack, weed, speed or drink) is about 20:1. As in, ca 5% manage to kill the habit by building up discipline enough to not do it.
The urge, the compulsion even, to do it is life-long. Same as getting in shape and keeping fit: habit, routine, discipline.
And the pitfalls and sirens of fail are the same too: other people helping to drag yourself down to their level, and a capitalistic market for quick fixes - panacea, silver bullet, magical snake-oil, and rationalisations and excuses galore. "I'm big boned" - "Oh yeah? That's your ass-bone there?"
According to the supervisor/owner of the gym I attended when we lived in the city, about 3 out of 8 new members taper off inside the first twelve weeks, and one more during the first half year. So 1/4 stays the course for longer than a year (weekly attendance). He based this off of the people who (like me) paid for a whole year. Why'd I do that and what does it have to do with Cat1/Cat2? It goes back to the ages-old truth "Gnothi seauton" - Know thyself.
And I know I'm a tight-wad skin-flint who hates waste. By paying for a year in advance, having calculated how often I'd have to attend to "earn" it back compared to paying separately, I gave myself compulsive motivation (Cat1), which kicked off my normal habitual discipline: if I do something, I do it all the way until the job's done (Cat2).
If you know what your /real/ motivation is, and can utilise that as fuel for creating disciplined behavioural habits/patterns, then I think you have both "belt and suspenders" to keep you going. Sort-of like having two crows, one of on each shoulder, alternating in goading you:
"C'mon lard-ass, you wanted to be able to see your dick in the shower without a hydraulic lift for your flab, git'r'done!" and "Whelp, it's a day ending in "y", that means it's time for the ole' hup-two-three-four at the gym, off we go then".
Suggestion, because this was a great choice of topic: gym-buddies and how that alters (or not) the Cat1/2 plus social schema, as a follow-up piece.
I agree it is motivation first, then discipline. I think t he distinction is those who do not leave cat 1; they don't make it to discipline so it is forever out of their grasp.
As for the suggestion. I am a solo artiste at the gym, so I have no experience of buddies or groups. I suspect it will help a great deal to keep people on track.
I've seen two kinds of gym pals-setups (apart from as you note how many women do it - as a social thing, doesn't mean they don't get a good workout in, but the social thing is the primary reason):
1) Often younger men, but sometimes middle-aged too. Loud, brash, boisterous and prone to stupidity, and fixated on quick fixes or the word of some supposed expert. Often into buying the right gear, where right equals brand name and price - including various powders.
(If they knew what they were made from, or that they retain less than 0.1% of the proteins in the powder, and sat down and calculated the price per kilo. . .?)
Anyway - high motivation in the form of peer pressure and socialising (just like the ladies). Often, such a group shrinks from half a dozen or more to 2-3 guys. Possibly, that is Cat1 becoming Cat2, since there's a noticeable process of maturing (even among the middle aged) going on, and the discipline shows in /how/ they do their sets and reps and so on.
2) Pairs or trios from the get-go. Often, the informal leader is the one disciplined and is acting as motivator for the other two, helping to guide them over the hump.
Crucial difference I've observed is, 2) is a group where no-one slacks. When one guy is doing hamstrings, his first mate is doing biceps curl and the second is doing skip-rope, and when no. 1 has done his 10 reps they switch places or move to other machines/stations. Zero time wasted, which means that they get much more done.
Me and my chum used to call it "all the body, all the time" as opposed to leg day and such.
When you have little kids or "interesting" partners who create chaos, it is very hard to get into Category 2 mode. Every day is a different day; you are always reacting to another's moods and needs. The freedom that precedes discipline is the freedom to *be* disciplined - a certain degree of control over your own daily life. Agency itself is a gift to be pursued and held. Great essay.
Yes, good point. The room to be consistent, such as running at the same time each day, may not be possible for everyone.
That said, the main idea is motivation is a mentally expensive process to rely on. If we can somehow push through the pain barrier and make something a habit we rely much less on motivating ourselves.
So it does presume the ability to carve out time for important things, which is not true for everyone.
“Discipline is difficult to discern, and it looks like motivation from the outside, but it is really automated behaviour.”
This is how you can drag yourself to the gym after too many glasses of Bordeaux the night before and leave feeling like you just had a spa day.
I often conflate lifting and writing in my routines. One discipline informs the other. Extremely helpful comparison.
Additional food for thought: spiritual training exercises also work off this principle of discipline vs motivation. The goal being to get into a state of mind which is “automatic” and not continually dislodged or thrown off-balance by the eternal Clowning going on all around us.
Thanks for this, Spiff. Very timely. Battling through some jet lag but today is bench/squat day.
Leg day for me.
I do think it is a universal path. We need some initial motivation of course. We get fat or weak and it motivates us to do something. I think those who fail continue to rely on motivation whereas the winners graduate to some form of mental automation.
There is something to be said for gritting your teeth and getting on with it.
I might have mentioned it before, but “Willpower” by Dr Roy Baumeister was really transformative and gives clear research supporting your claims. Discipline actually conserves willpower because you’re not making many agonizing choices. “Will I go to the gym or not? Will I do a half work out or a full work out? Will I finish this set?” You just pick the program and don’t let the question even come up. Now I only stop if I feel like I could injure some muscle. Another mental framing that is helpful is pre planned “If X, then Y” for what could happen. “If I get winded, then I’ll go on the elliptical rather than treadmill.” That type of stuff is good because it front loads the decision making process when your brain and body are not fatigued.
All good advice. Willpower is aided by deciding in advance then sticking to it.
I don't do the gym (small and skinny so would get the figurative sand in my face, maybe LOL). But it occurred to me as I was reading your piece that I have often recommended to people that they should encourage their children to learn a "discipline" like learning a musical instrument - the only thing I can speak with any authority on, as it happens - without really being conscious of why I was using that particular word, instead of "hobby" or "pastime" for example.
Then it became clear. Even now after most of a life playing the guitar, the process of starting to learn a new piece with any amount of challenge is still a slow drag for the first few sessions, with the feeling of little or almost imperceptible progress, as if I have never been here before with every other piece I have eventually (more or less) mastered.
It's as you say exactly. The disciplinary path is by nature more an act of blind faith that the result will happen; we need to completely forget motivation, because it's just too capricious and inconsistent a driver to make the leap from one plateau to the next.
It's the same with climbing a hill. People say to me : "Don't you get a bit bored just going up and climbing the same range of hills every week?". Well, I've been doing exactly that for so many years now that I don't even think about whether I should just give it a miss because the conditions are not great.....or it might be better in a few days....etc. I just make it a rule that at least once a week, I will head up and do a few hills. And some days are better conditions than others, but it's almost incidental. It needs to be for all the reasons you describe.
I think motivation is the start. You are motivated to lose weight or begin hiking, for instance. But it cannot sustain the activities. Something else must do so.
Discipline I suspect is really an umbrella term for initially forcing yourself to repeat an activity long enough to make it a habit. From then on the brain's various reward loops assist with keeping it going.
Oh yes, the motivation must always be there in some form to initiate anything, I agree. But maybe for most, once the task or task path is initiated, it has served its purpose largely, as the results become the reward and the process perpetuates itself.
Only if you get through the initial habit forming part. That is difficult. Just as it is difficult to give up bad habits.
Yes. Discipline applies to many things; music (you have to practice every day), exercise, being tidy, brushing your teeth!
I wonder if discipline is inherent; some people just seem more disciplined than others at an earlier age. I feel I've had to learn discipline.
As someone who has lifted 4 days a week, week in and week out, for decades I can attest to discipline being more important than motivation. Motivation may get you excited but discipline sustains you when it sucks.
I am not sure it in inherent. I suspect it is a learned skill. As noted in the article, some have nothing they are disciplined about.
But on the other han some are disciplined about a lot of things…in fact, according some research what we call “genius” is not really intelligence as much as disciplined devotion to a particular endeavor.
I do agree it can be learned, though…I certainly had to learn it.
It is difficult to say. Perhaps some just have a capacity for repetition. Many nowadays have low boredom thresholds, so it is difficult to imagine they will be self-disciplined as it is often quite boring to establish habits.
My oh my, what a truth bomb. I hate gym. Never went for the social aspect either. But you are so right! The only discipline i display is in my work. Definitely cat 2 there! Best wishes for 2025!
Using discipline to create habits is not for everything. But for things you choose to go this route it is hard to beat.
Great article. Absolutely right.
Thanks for reading.
A pleasure. Thank you for writing it.
This is a good piece, and I will have to reread it to digest it fully. However, I think you may have sparked an inspiration for me to write my own similar article about the "types" who attend therapy because they would be verrrrry similar.
Good job!
Please do. Let me know when you do. Spotting patterns is endlessly fascinating.
I liken your spot on analogy to the sport of football, which I have on this time of year since it’s mainly cold here November to February. Teams seem to need pepped up motivation to perform, which fades when setbacks occur and constantly need to try to remotivate(some do some don’t). Personally, I prefer the disciplined, consistency of the steady and detail oriented coaches and styled teams. Funny(not really), the pepped ones draw all the attention but the disciplined succeed more, or at least used too, and are usually more humble when they do. Anyway, love your common sense words of wisdom as usual. God Bless you in a disciplined New Year ahead!!!
Motivation is great to get started. It is probably a necessity. But remaining stuck using motivation is not sustainable as it is mentally expensive. I think that is all it is.
Motivation is probably good for CHANGE, but inappropriate for CONSISTENCY. Perhaps that is it.
1.21 "jigga-whats" of truth right there.
You can move from Cat1 to Cat2, I have observed. Can't exactly pin it down but I'd say it happens if the Cat1 makes discipline part of the motivation and makes it over the hump(s), to eventually realise that the initial motivation is gone, and has been replaced with discipline, habit and real change.
It is much the same as the process for alcoholics and drug users. Some have some form of motivation, and fail. Some have dredged up whatever iota of discipline they have left, and succeed. The ratio (doesn't matter if it's smack, weed, speed or drink) is about 20:1. As in, ca 5% manage to kill the habit by building up discipline enough to not do it.
The urge, the compulsion even, to do it is life-long. Same as getting in shape and keeping fit: habit, routine, discipline.
And the pitfalls and sirens of fail are the same too: other people helping to drag yourself down to their level, and a capitalistic market for quick fixes - panacea, silver bullet, magical snake-oil, and rationalisations and excuses galore. "I'm big boned" - "Oh yeah? That's your ass-bone there?"
According to the supervisor/owner of the gym I attended when we lived in the city, about 3 out of 8 new members taper off inside the first twelve weeks, and one more during the first half year. So 1/4 stays the course for longer than a year (weekly attendance). He based this off of the people who (like me) paid for a whole year. Why'd I do that and what does it have to do with Cat1/Cat2? It goes back to the ages-old truth "Gnothi seauton" - Know thyself.
And I know I'm a tight-wad skin-flint who hates waste. By paying for a year in advance, having calculated how often I'd have to attend to "earn" it back compared to paying separately, I gave myself compulsive motivation (Cat1), which kicked off my normal habitual discipline: if I do something, I do it all the way until the job's done (Cat2).
If you know what your /real/ motivation is, and can utilise that as fuel for creating disciplined behavioural habits/patterns, then I think you have both "belt and suspenders" to keep you going. Sort-of like having two crows, one of on each shoulder, alternating in goading you:
"C'mon lard-ass, you wanted to be able to see your dick in the shower without a hydraulic lift for your flab, git'r'done!" and "Whelp, it's a day ending in "y", that means it's time for the ole' hup-two-three-four at the gym, off we go then".
Suggestion, because this was a great choice of topic: gym-buddies and how that alters (or not) the Cat1/2 plus social schema, as a follow-up piece.
I agree it is motivation first, then discipline. I think t he distinction is those who do not leave cat 1; they don't make it to discipline so it is forever out of their grasp.
As for the suggestion. I am a solo artiste at the gym, so I have no experience of buddies or groups. I suspect it will help a great deal to keep people on track.
I've seen two kinds of gym pals-setups (apart from as you note how many women do it - as a social thing, doesn't mean they don't get a good workout in, but the social thing is the primary reason):
1) Often younger men, but sometimes middle-aged too. Loud, brash, boisterous and prone to stupidity, and fixated on quick fixes or the word of some supposed expert. Often into buying the right gear, where right equals brand name and price - including various powders.
(If they knew what they were made from, or that they retain less than 0.1% of the proteins in the powder, and sat down and calculated the price per kilo. . .?)
Anyway - high motivation in the form of peer pressure and socialising (just like the ladies). Often, such a group shrinks from half a dozen or more to 2-3 guys. Possibly, that is Cat1 becoming Cat2, since there's a noticeable process of maturing (even among the middle aged) going on, and the discipline shows in /how/ they do their sets and reps and so on.
2) Pairs or trios from the get-go. Often, the informal leader is the one disciplined and is acting as motivator for the other two, helping to guide them over the hump.
Crucial difference I've observed is, 2) is a group where no-one slacks. When one guy is doing hamstrings, his first mate is doing biceps curl and the second is doing skip-rope, and when no. 1 has done his 10 reps they switch places or move to other machines/stations. Zero time wasted, which means that they get much more done.
Me and my chum used to call it "all the body, all the time" as opposed to leg day and such.
I have seen examples of these myself. I think you are correct.
Maturing into a disciplined routine is an inherently solo affair, even with friends. I suspect this is why so few do it.
Yeah I'm too much cat 2 for sure. But there's nothing in my life that warrants cat 1 discipline.
Habits are impossible to form unless they're bad for you. Nothing Good Has Ever Happened.
Motivation is dead. Discipline doesn’t make a damn. If you weren’t already an 11/10 Super-Chad, you’re not getting anywhere.
Also: Infinity Jeets. Infinity Haitians. Infinity Trannies and Nothing Good Has Ever Happened.